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 occupation or liberation

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LPF



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PostSubject: occupation or liberation   Thu May 17, 2007 5:10 pm

what the hell was it then??
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Krissukristel

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PostSubject: Re: occupation or liberation   Thu May 17, 2007 5:12 pm

It would have been liberation if they would have left after liberating.
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Voodoo

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PostSubject: Re: occupation or liberation   Thu May 17, 2007 6:30 pm

and we would be thankful for that untill today, would selebrate 8th may but...
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Hypno
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PostSubject: Re: occupation or liberation   Thu May 17, 2007 6:38 pm

Krissukristel wrote:
It would have been liberation if they would have left after liberating.
Thus, it was an occupation.

And quoting wikipedia:
Estonia was occupied by Soviet troops in June 1940, as a consequence of the secret amendment to the August 1939 Molotov-Ribbentrop Pact between the Soviet Union and Nazi Germany. Estonia was formally annexed by the Soviet Union in August 1940 as the Estonian SSR. Many of the country's political and intellectual leaders were killed or deported to remote areas of the USSR by the Soviet authorities during 1940 to 1941. The repressions also included actions taken against thousands of ordinary people. When the German Operation Barbarossa started against the Soviet Union, thousands of young Estonian men were forcibly drafted into the Red Army.

I wonder do most russians even know that they were allies with the nazis at the start of WWII?


Read more at http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Estonia#Under_the_USSR
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DerDieDas



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PostSubject: Re: occupation or liberation   Thu May 17, 2007 7:32 pm

On the one hand it was a liberation on the other a occupation. study
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Risto

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PostSubject: Re: occupation or liberation   Thu May 17, 2007 7:39 pm

Even if Russia had lost, we would still have been occupied by Nazis. Who knows how long. Neutral
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LPF



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PostSubject: Re: occupation or liberation   Thu May 17, 2007 7:47 pm

/In September 1944, after German forces left, legal power was briefly restored as Otto Tief formed a new government in accordance with the 1938 constitution. The Tief government, though, lasted for only 5 days, as Estonia was again occupied by the Soviet Union./

rabbit
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Earthland



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PostSubject: Re: occupation or liberation   Thu May 17, 2007 7:53 pm

Of course it was occupation.

Remember: They killed 17% of Estonians and even more were deported to Siberia.

And this is liberating?

It was just one criminal regime (nazis) changing with other (soviets). Yes, they fought against nazis, but not because they "loved and cared about Estonia so much", but because they wanted to occupate us, and in order to do that, the fough against nazis.
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DerDieDas



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PostSubject: Re: occupation or liberation   Thu May 17, 2007 8:00 pm

There is no need to "love" someone. Soviet army liberated Estonia from nazis and this is a fact. study
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Earthland



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PostSubject: Re: occupation or liberation   Thu May 17, 2007 8:05 pm

No, they didn't. Nazis were left, when Soviet army came to Tallinn. And Soviets immediately imposed a regime of terror. 50 years occupation can't be taken as liberation by any standards.
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Krissukristel

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PostSubject: Re: occupation or liberation   Thu May 17, 2007 8:06 pm

and the fact is also that they themselves didnt left after liberating, and killed alot of ppl, and tried to make all estonians into russians (thats the reason so many russians were brought to live in occupied countrys. and our national songs were denied etc.)
I dare to say russians in estonia live better now, then estonians lived under russia back then
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Earthland



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PostSubject: Re: occupation or liberation   Thu May 17, 2007 8:14 pm

Russians have their own TV, magazines, ... they can get jobs as well, they don't need to know estonian, expected if they want govermental job or become teacher in estonian school Rolling Eyes

But very common e.g: One Russian told me I'm fascist because I speak estonian Rolling Eyes
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DerDieDas



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PostSubject: Re: occupation or liberation   Thu May 17, 2007 8:24 pm

Quote :
No, they didn't. Nazis were left, when Soviet army came to Tallinn.

Laughing Why had Nazis to leave baltic countries?

Quote :
and tried to make all estonians into russians (thats the reason so many russians were brought to live in occupied countrys. and our national songs were denied etc.)

Do you know the difference between "Russian" and "Soviet" ? I think you have no idea about it.

Quote :
and the fact is also that they themselves didnt left after liberating

Of course, but don´t forget this first fact. Wink
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Earthland



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PostSubject: Re: occupation or liberation   Thu May 17, 2007 8:27 pm

"Soviet" was name given to Russian murderers and fascists.
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Krissukristel

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PostSubject: Re: occupation or liberation   Thu May 17, 2007 8:32 pm

its a good thing you brought it up

becose one article just talked about it.
that the soldier was soviet statue. and Jeltsin did his best to step away from soviet inheritence (or else they have to pay money to the victioms of soviet union's regime)
But suddenly russia makes noise when we remove it. Thats a clear step closer to admiting beeng Soviet Unions offspring.
russians want to take the good (the glory of bringing nazis to their knees) but not the bad (killing millions of ppl) and it dont work that way
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DerDieDas



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PostSubject: Re: occupation or liberation   Thu May 17, 2007 8:35 pm

Quote :
"Soviet" was name given to Russian murderers and fascists.

It would be absolut true if I would say that your statement was absolutely dumb. Dumb like hell. affraid

study You really need to educate yourself.
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DerDieDas



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PostSubject: Re: occupation or liberation   Thu May 17, 2007 8:39 pm

Quote :
But suddenly russia makes noise when we remove it. Thats a clear step closer to admiting beeng Soviet Unions offspring.
russians want to take the good (the glory of bringing nazis to their knees) but not the bad (killing millions of ppl) and it dont work that way

They do that because the victory against nazis was a victory for the people but the "bad things" was the earning of soviet government.
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Voodoo

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PostSubject: Re: occupation or liberation   Thu May 17, 2007 8:50 pm

DerDieDas if your family was raped first by one man and then by another who killes the first criminal - would you say that the second rapist is a hero simply because he killed the first rapist?
And would you put a statute of the second rapist into your living room and make your family look at it for 50 years while the rapists family drinks vodka in your home?
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Vabapaase



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PostSubject: Re: occupation or liberation   Thu May 17, 2007 9:02 pm

Risto wrote:
Even if Russia had lost, we would still have been occupied by Nazis. Who knows how long. Neutral


Yes, true...but communists are always worse. My English teacher was telling us a story how different armies were acting. When Germans came into the house, they left their weapons at the door and took hats off, but when Russians came in, they were pointing the gun at everybody and mostly saying dirty words...
But atleast we are independent now...and we have to keep it that way! Wink
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Helena

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PostSubject: Re: occupation or liberation   Thu May 17, 2007 9:09 pm

Vabapaase, I actually don't suggest you to believe it too much. I've heard different stories as well.
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Voodoo

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PostSubject: Re: occupation or liberation   Thu May 17, 2007 9:16 pm

to Vabapaase i just wanted to point out same thing, ive heared many similar stories also.
As we see russians are still acting like šovinistic bigs in Estonia. Almost all of their replys in forum "russistic" they dont say it out but many would be clad if russia would occupy estonia again.
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DerDieDas



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PostSubject: Re: occupation or liberation   Thu May 17, 2007 9:23 pm

2 Kaspar

This occupation has nothing to do with "raping" and you should just accept the facts. Soviet Union liberated Estonia from nazis. (If you don´t believe me, then you should ask this question to some victims of nazis.) Neutral
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DerDieDas



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PostSubject: Re: occupation or liberation   Thu May 17, 2007 9:30 pm

Quote :
As we see russians are still acting like šovinistic bigs in Estonia. Almost all of their replys in forum "russistic" they dont say it out but many would be clad if russia would occupy estonia again.

What do you talking about? Suspect

Should I maybe subordinate to you that you would like to expel all Russians from Europe?

be friedly and tolerant ??? Question Exclamation
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Voodoo

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PostSubject: Re: occupation or liberation   Thu May 17, 2007 9:54 pm

It was comparison!

DerDieDas you are not being tolerant, all you say is that "russians saved you from fascism, russians saved you from fascism" russia occupied us for 50 years, killed 17% of our nation, tried to inject idiotism to our minds, took away every kind of freedom, tried to make us in to god damn communists.
When will your mind get that? When will you be tolerant to other nations?
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DerDieDas



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PostSubject: Re: occupation or liberation   Thu May 17, 2007 10:01 pm

Kaspar , i just said the truth. Soviet Union liberated your country from Nazis and you should accept this fact. Of course, after this liberating Stalin decidet to occupe baltic states, but it is an other story.

Because of that fact:

On the one hand soviets liberated Estonia and on the other hand they occuped this country. study
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